hsbc payment in fraud review

[Rollerboy]

Hi,

actinic 7.0.3 hsbc secure epayments

When an order goes into 'fraud review' on hsbc secure epayments, I dont receive a callback... so the order stays in PSP pending.

I understand I need to either accept/reject the payment in secure epayments, and then manually process the order in actinic.

My question is, can I receive an email or notification that a payment has gone into fraud review?

Hsbs secure payments helpline told me they issue a 'response code 9' when the order goes into 'fraud review' however this response doesnt seem to do anything in actinic. So I dont know a payment has gone into 'fraud review' :eek:

This is worrying because, the customer gets the receipt page and imagines the order has gone through ok.. but all I see is another order in 'psp pending' along with all the failed payments.. Actinic doesnt distinguish between them!
and I dont know unless I log in to secure epayments... something I cant do everyday as I'm not around. I also dont want the 'packing person' working for me to have access to secure epayments.

Does actinic not do this? :confused:
If it doesnt, how can I turn the 'response code 9' into an email or notification of some kind?

Best Regards

[Mike Hughes]

All Actinic knows is that there's no callback to confirm payment. Is the customer really getting to the receipt page? (are you seeing the order confirmation email?)

You should be getting emails from HSBC with the payment details for every order. If not then you probably need to contact HSBC.

Mike

[Rollerboy]

Is that right?
Does hsbc secure epayments send an email for every payment received?
Can anyone using secure epayments confirm that?

The hsbc helpline told me there were no emails.:confused:

[Mike Hughes]

Maybe they don't.

I'm surprised though. Secpay / paypoint send me an email for each payment detailing the level of verification achieved (and whether a callback is requested).

I have to admit I thought they all did this.

Mike

[guccij]

No, HSBC doesn't send any kind of email when a payment goes through or it is rejected. I've been on at them for years but they just don't get why this is important, for us as well as for the customers.

To be honest, you need to be checking the EPayments fraud review all the time - if you can check Actinic and download orders, I don't understand why you can't go online and check EPayments :confused:

[guccij]

In any event, almost all of the orders which HSBC flags up are fine, I just think HSBC are extra cautious. After all, the CVC has to match before the order gets anywhere near the Pending tab. Most seem to be HSBC's inability to "read" Scottish addresses (e.g. flat 3f3, 2/2 Hamilton Rd) or not liking when a UK person places an order at 3am (which in my line of business is quite normal).

But to go back to the OP, there's no way Actinic can send you an email to tell you there's an order in the Pending tab. Not possible.

[TraceyHand]

Maybe they don't.

I'm surprised though. Secpay / paypoint send me an email for each payment detailing the level of verification achieved (and whether a callback is requested).

I have to admit I thought they all did this.

Mike

Actinic Payments doesn't either!
I have to admit, it's one thing I hated most about using AP and one of the most unsung features of the PSPs that do, IMO!

[Rollerboy]

I see, thanks for the replies.

To be honest, you need to be checking the EPayments fraud review all the time - if you can check Actinic and download orders, I don't understand why you can't go online and check EPayments

I'm not in the office very much... I am on the road a lot making sales.
I didnt really want the person packing orders for me to have access to the secure epayments site. I was happy with them just having actinic as their workstation.

So this is a bit of a pain.
Would there be any way of adding some code somewhere to trigger an email when hsbc gives actinic a response code 9?
Actinic obviously listens to the response code that tells it the payment has gone through. Why not response code 9 too?
Any code monkeys wanna engineer this hack for a fee?

[guccij]

I don't have a problem with my staff accessing EPayments. It's not like they can steal someone's card details :confused:

All they can do is view payments, bank settlements and make refunds or voids. They can also of course see what's in fraud review and presumably, a call to you to tell you what's in there would enable you to take a judgement on whether or not to proceed.

Alternatively, mobile broadband, a Blackberry or an iPhone in your pocket and you can do it yourself. I imagine you have at least some downtime in your busy schedule?

[Rollerboy]

Not an ideal solution as far as I'm concerned.
Initially 25-40% of orders were going into fraud review..
I want the office to run on its own, and dont want to be contacted regarding every 'fraud review' and neither did I want my staff making these decisions for me, especially on large transactions.

Most seem to be HSBC's inability to "read" Scottish addresses (e.g. flat 3f3, 2/2 Hamilton Rd) or not liking when a UK person places an order at 3am (which in my line of business is quite normal).



A quick call to hsbc sorted both those events anyway.. you can change the fraud settings..
1. so that only the postcode has to match.. that gets rid of the problem of people typing in variations of flat numbers.
2. you can switch off the 'odd time for a UK order' function too.

Still... I'd have liked actinic to be 'stand alone' as far as this goes... at lease an email trigger would be nice as TraceyHand said.

[Rollerboy]

All in all this actinic/hsbc set up is pretty shaky isnt it..
Customers are being directed back to my receipt page, even if their order goes into fraud review!!
So as far as these customers are concerned their payment is accepted AND they have a printed receipt for the order.. (i've just been sent one) but their payment has not actually gone through !!
Whats that all about? :eek:

[guccij]

Oh wtf can't be arsed. I do wonder why people use Actinic if they hate it so much.

[Rollerboy]

well you buy it expecting it to work.

I just did a totally bogus order to test it.. As if I'd nicked a credit card..
All card details correct.. billing address and delivery address totally made up.

Order went through fine... and I was directed back to my receipt page !

On the hsbc site the order goes in to fraud review!!

So a customer has a receipt from the shop and hasnt paid..!!

...and you think thats ok? oh dear.

[Rich Brady]

All in all this actinic/hsbc set up is pretty shaky isnt it..

With all due respect a lot as changed since the days of V7 and earlier. Ecommerce software and PSPs are very different these days.

Actinics most recent software comined with Actinict Payments would give you a red flag within the orders tab, through 3rd man.

well you buy it expecting it to work.

I just did a totally bogus order to test it.. As if I'd nicked a credit card..
All card details correct.. billing address and delivery address totally made up.

Order went through fine... and I was directed back to my receipt page !

On the hsbc site the order goes in to fraud review!!

So a customer has a receipt from the shop and hasnt paid..!!

...and you think thats ok? oh dear.

If you insist on using obsolete software then you have to work with what you have and if HSBC aren't going to send you an email then you need to check fraud review regulary, why wouldn't you.

Why don't you upgrade?

[Rollerboy]

Fair point...
good to hear things have improved.

Hard to believe though that thats how its been working for the last few years..
and actually... correct me if I'm wrong, but the integration with v9 and hsbc secure epayments is the same as v7 isnt it?

on another point... word in my ear is that v7 was the best actinic, and it got buggy and confusing since then... If you look at the forum viewing figures, you'll see that theres always lots more people viewing the v7 and earlier forum than the v8 or v9 forums.

[Rich Brady]

on another point... word in my ear is that v7 was the best actinic, and it got buggy and confusing since then... If you look at the forum viewing figures, you'll see that theres always lots more people viewing the v7 and earlier forum than the v8 or v9 forums.

Hmmm, or it could be that Actinic only support the two most recent versions ;-)

[Rollerboy]

that may have something to do with it I suppose..
but I do here people saying that v7 was the most stable and easy to use version.

Is the hsbc epayments integration in v9 any different to v7 though?
Because if it isnt then upgrading will change nothing, the problems mentioned before will be the same. Getting a receipt for an order that hasnt gone through is quite wrong.

[guccij]

You know there are alternative payment providers out there, you're not willing to change one single thing about the way you run your store, your only "evidence" is based on hearsay and you slag off the software which this forum supports. Maybe you should spend less time "making sales" and more time in the office, and learn what Actinic is all about.

[Rich Brady]

Getting a receipt for an order that hasnt gone through is quite wrong.

As Jules says there are other options to you. Unfortunately for you this is a problem that needs to be resolved by HSBC not Actinic, so there's little we or Actinic can do to help/adivse.

Have you contacted HSBC?

[Rollerboy]

blimey Jules ! take a chill pill !

'bed' and 'got out of wrong side' spring to mind.

What do you mean I'm 'not willing to change one single thing' ??
Of course I am.
I pay people to run my office and pack orders... Is that wierd or something?

I feel like I've stumbled into a scene from deliverance.

I notice no-one has answered as to whether the v9 HSBC integration is any different to the v7 integration.

Unfortunately for you this is a problem that needs to be resolved by HSBC not Actinic

I'm sorry, but with respect, I dont agree. Actinic advertises an integration with HSBC secure Epayments. Yes I have contacted HSBC. HSBC issues a response code 9, when an order goes into 'fraud review'. Unfortunately, Actinic doesnt do anything when it receives this response. That, is not HSBCs fault.
The result, as described is that even failed orders get a receipt from the shop ! That is not a proper integration.

There are of course many PSPs... I sell worldwide and the HSBC brand is one of the most recognisable in the world. I chose HSBC specifically for their branded payment page.

[Duncan Rounding]

The payment integration is usually the responsibilty of the PSP. Actinic sells an integration toolkit to the PSP who then program the interface.

I'm not sure if this was true in this case but may well be.

[guccij]

I chose HSBC specifically for their branded payment page.Well maybe that was the wrong decision, given that the integration isn't what you're looking for. Am wondering when you first noticed the problem with the PSP Pending orders?
Also wondering what your site url is as we have keen skaters chez nous.

[Rollerboy]

Hi Duncan,

Hhmm.. are you sure thats right?

Not according to HSBC at any rate.

and the actinic paypal integration was not built by paypal either.. I know that much...

I'm dubious as to if it really ever is that way round. PSPs have their own integration instructions for carts and designers to follow... not the other way round. Actinic is relatively small fry compared to hsbc, paypal, worldpay, sage etc.. I'm sorry I cant see the onus being on them to build integrations..

[Duncan Rounding]

Try the google search at the top of the forum for 'payment integration kit'. I expect it's a bit of tit for tat and negotiation.

[Rich Brady]

The problem you are faced with is that all the PSPs, in your case HSBC, are doing is flagging transaction that "could" be fraudulent.#

This could happen because the customer doesn't reside in the UK, they've keyed something in wrong or they are actualy using a stolen card.

Not an ideal solution as far as I'm concerned.
Initially 25-40% of orders were going into fraud review.

If what you want was to be implemented and every transaction that goes into fraud review does not complete then essentially a 3rd of your customers will perceive their order to be cancelled, would they not?

It doesn't sound like you are going to get what you want unless you upgrade to V9 and use AP. Orders will still be downloaded into Actinic as with HSBC, but there will be a dirty red light next to any order that "could" be bogus. Your staff can then look at the payment details all within the Actinic Software and make a decision there and then based on a set of criteria you have given them.

[Rollerboy]

If what you want was to be implemented and every transaction that goes into fraud review does not complete then essentially a 3rd of your customers will perceive their order to be cancelled, would they not?

Yes thats true. I can see your point.

..and the AP integration for v9 does sound like it works how I would expect.
Having looked at the Ap payment system on other sites.. I was concerned that 'Actinic' is not a well known enough brand.. and didnt instill as much trust as HSBC or other well known brands. Maybe I'm over cautious and web shoppers arent that worried about the pages they enter card details on. For me I always want to see a padlocked page on a site I've heard of.

[cbarling]

Just a few comments on this thread.

Firstly, the HSBC ePayments integration is the same in v9 as in v7. The ePayments integration with Actinic was commissioned by HSBC and built by Actinic to their specification. The agreement was that if things changed, HSBC could commission us to make the changes. They haven't done so in this case.

The AP lack of branding awareness doesn't appear to be a problem, based on quite a bit of feedback on this forum. In addition, a lot of people brand the Actinic Payments (AP) payment page with their own store branding. The advanced SSL certificate (which leads to the green bar on the browser address) is non-trivial to obtain and ensures that the site isn't a scam. It is true, however, that not a lot of consumers know that. But if they refer to a security expert, that's what they would be told.

This may sound strange, and almost unbelievable, but I personally have heard of two merchants that reported that customers have not paid via HSBC "because I don't have an HSBC card" or similar words. I've not yet heard of one report of poeple abandoning AP because they didn't recognise the brand.I would be surprised if people haven't occasionally done so because of this issue, but if they do, it is clearly on a very, very small scale.

When we introduced AP, brand recognition was one of my concerns, but hasn't been an issue in practise. It's one of those cases that what logically seems like it might be an issue turns out not to be. See the recent discussion on SSL cerrificates in checkout for a similar perplexing example.

We're currently seeing a rapidly rising uptake of Actinic Payments, so something has got to be right. Creditcall are being similarly successful, and it's very likely that virtually all of us have put card payments through their network, independent of Actinic, already. They have just secured another massive payments win, although it's not public knowledge yet.

Chris

[Rollerboy]

Hi Chris

Thanks for the info re the integration of hsbc and v7 and v9.

and also your comments regarding AP branding.. as I said.. I may have been being over-cautious regarding the branding etc.. maybe customers are less cautious generally. The integration does sound excellent.. I will have to do some thinking.

All the best